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Links Between Realms/Dimensions Discussion
By Earthwalker



A lot of you have been responding to me at length and probably getting somewhat frustrate with me. Please remember the semantics of these realms are somewhat foreign to me. I have given a lot of thought to the words of Doc and Silver Eagle (Connections) as well as Cinnamon and Lune and probably could accept their thoughts (Doc and Silver Eagle) if I could solve what I'll call the linkage between realms. Let me try to explain.

Premises:
1.)Simple expressed, in the physical realm, the responses generated by a stimulus of any kind (the cause) yields a corresponding effect (result) on an organism. This reaction occurs in the dimension of linear time.

2.)In the spiritual realms, a form(s) of pure energy (undefined) exists. It exists in a dimension of timelessness; therefore the laws of cause and effect do not apply. Since there is no time dimension there cannot be a reaction without a stimulus; only an equilibrium between existing states of energy can exist. In other words, the realm of spirit needs a stimulus from the physical realm to change its state of equilibrium.

3.)The spiritual realm can therefore only cause an effect in linear time by interacting in a mechanical way [probably as a catalysis] in-acting a change in the physical. Alternatively the physical realm can cause a change in the equilibrium of the spiritual realm which it cannot do without such a linkage due to the timelessness in the spiritual realm.

I have a few questions I am struggling with.

Can anyone help or have you read or heard of anything in regards to the above or the following questions.

Thoughts/questions:
What is the mechanism/linkage of this interaction or catalysis between realms (energy to physical or physical to energy)? If the mechanism is through an interaction of the energy imbedded in physical entities what level is it at? The elemental, the molecular, the cellular, the organism or the species? This may be partly answered by where spirit interactions in the physical realm can occur. From a shamanic perspective, interactions occur, I believe, at all levels where life exits (species/ organism/ cellular).

Can interaction occur with non-living matter (stones, earth, etc.) without a primary connection to another physical entity with spirit being the intermediary? If so then the action could be at either the elemental or molecular level. If not what level of consciousness does the living organism need to possess to be able to tap into the spiritual realm? If energy/spirit can shapeshift and enter other areas and physically change the location of items etc. what connection needs to be on the other end? For this to occur there must be some type of physical interaction between the spirit energy and the object or object energy.

If this is true, this just answered in part my above question since if you can move a non-living object purely from the spiritual dimension then the mechanism of action must be at the molecular or elemental level. However, this would be true only if another connection is not being made to a living species in another location of the physical realm connected through the spiritual realm. What I am looking for is what is the physical /energy or mechanism of change occurring in the physical realm to link to the spirit world and physical world or worlds in other dimensions. If this one link could be defined or made known it would clarify so much and answers the question of portals, shapeshifting, journeying etc. I know that there are theories out there which suggest that long term memory actual resides in a universal field of energy but still the theories do not define the linkage from the physical entity to this universal memory bank or dimension other than to define a god spot in the right temporal lobe.

If anyone has thoughts or ideas please let me know. I know and believe in Shamanism but I also know that there also has to be change at the physical level to gain access to other realms of spirit etc. I would love to understand as well as believe.

Northernwolf:
Will and intent.

Earthwalker:
Nothernwolf, Thanks! It does make sense. Will and intent are definitely links. Wouldn't it be nice if we could will matter (like the dirt in my house) to just dissipate into energy(s). Cinnamon, Thank for all your time addressing this and I apologize for bringing up a pet peeve. There are many things in science that cannot be validated either. The technology simply is not sophisticated enough to answer the question. I don't have a problem with anyone indicating that the answer is not known.

From my perspective, belief systems (religions, shamanism etc.) became so much easier to understand once I learned (as a child) the basic science premise that energy can neither be created or destroyed only changed. This fits in completely with your discussion on source energy. I just simply posed a simpler model than your discussion. My lack of understanding reside in realms were past and present and probable future co-exist. Given current theory in that dimension cause and effect without an external source cannot occur. I think the point I missed is that the total state of energy is in constant change yielding the outside stimulus that permits change in those realms. Matter is simply tightly packed cells of energy (stone being more dense than a feather) etc. Realms with differing density is easy to understand. I left multiple realms out of the original premise to simplify the discussion. Brainwaves / energy have a corresponding biochemical change effecting the brain amine levels etc.

This is probably the link I was looking for. I will take you advise and explore more fully the answers from the spirit guides that seem to be coming to me. I appreciate your answer and honesty. Have a peaceful journey. I will take you advise and explore more fully the answers from the spirit guides that seem to be coming to me. I appreciate your answer and honesty. Have a peaceful journey.

Cinnamon:
I was not unhappily challenged by your question. Science itself is not my basis for things as I take to the spiritual explanations easier and they make "sense" to me more so than Science does. I may grumble about it but it's just me and nothing to do with the individual asking. Please don't think this was a problem, I just approached it from my perspectives. I need to go through this from time to time anyway. LOL.

As for bringing up pet peeves, that's all they are, things that rub you wrong and I think we all have them. My tendency is to sidetrack with them though and then I get on a soapbox I shouldn't publicly stand on. So I just reference it as a peeve and let it go. (It makes my lengthy blustering posts much shorter believe it or not!)

It's actually quite reassuring to me that Science has it's grey areas of understanding too.

"I think the point I missed is that the total state of energy is in constant change yielding the outside stimulus that permits change in those realms.

" Yes! And you put it in a much nicer nutshell than I did too! LOL

"Brainwaves / energy have a corresponding biochemical change effecting the brain amine levels etc. This is probably the link I was looking for.

" Well technical terms escape me, but I do know that the state of mind has a very important function to all spiritual work and the stronger the thought, vision, and focus are the better you are able to work or communicate, journey or quest, etc. That's enough for me to accept and move ahead. It's the method that works for the individual in perceiving and we all have our own way of doing that. Yours is just as valid as any other.

I try to keep things very simple and let others expand where they need to. I guess it's all just relative to who we are as individuals. Whatever the triggers are, the fact remains that different states of consciousness and different levels of energy exist and work in harmony when you open to them.

"I will take you advise and explore more fully the answers from the spirit guides that seem to be coming to me. I appreciate your answer and honesty. Have a peaceful journey. " Well the reason I said that is because they do understand how your particular thought processes work and can explain things much better than I can. My attempt would look quite feeble to theirs and I assure you they won't need analogy or lengthy explanations like I do. LOL. I'm happy to try to help though and will always do so when I can.

As for my journey...well, that's so at peace right now that I'm skipping down the road loving every step. I got my wings. *G* Thank you for blessing it and perhaps ensuring part of that continuance though. I appreciate that! Now let's see if one of our more scientifically minded friends here can help you out a lot more and shed more light than I could. I'm sure one or all of them will.

Earthwalker:
Cinnamon, I believe the dream also dealt with similar topic and I have been asking the black jaguar for understanding.

I finally am beginning to understand. It is all about the balance of energy. Blackness is nothing the absence of color. White is the summation of all colors. This was shown in the dream as a black jaguar with minor gray spots; all other animals were white with tinges of gray. The jaguars power was so dominant since it had to balance the multiple white species present; once again creating an equilibrium between all. Each of these white species represent the summation of other multiple species / realms of all color with the summation being white.

There are other meaning as well coming from the dream but are of a more limited and personal nature but again are being defined in the context of the balance of power. Thank you for continuing to force me to contact the spirits directly. This is the first time I have understood how that can happen.

In addition this simple understanding opens up the understanding of all many of the prophetic dreams around the world.

Cinnamon:
Hello Earthwalker, I just wanted to point out to you that in shamanic terms White Animal Teachers come to us as Sacred Truths from Spirit representing the highest essence of their species and wisdom. The Black Animal Teachers represent the feminine perspective, Grandmother Moon, Night, the stillness within us. That may help you a little too. I hope so. Science is a masculine field in that it is an aggressive path to validate with physical evidence. Spirituality is balanced with the feminine...intuitive, guidance, stillness, feeling, sensations, etc. So you were being told (again IMHO) to seek balance in your perspective. Jaguar itself represents the feminine and night. Magic and mystery. ~!^

Earthwalker:
Cinnamon, I agree with the balance perspective and also agree with the comments you have made that the spirit world would know how to answer questions that I would understand.

Magic is defined as "conjuring tricks and illusions that make apparently impossible things seem to happen or supernatural power to make impossible things happen" No spirit of integrity would ever approach me with magic in mind. It is not a path that I would walk and leads me to question the validness of the path for me. If magic, sorcery, negative energy /spirits are the core of shamanism I have labeled my path incorrectly. My view of shamanism is strictly from a positive spiritualistic focus. Given people's reluctance to be completely open and honest / unwillingness to post I am not sure of my comfort level. From my perspective, tricks, games, negativity is inefficient and a complete waste of time. This is not to judge, just to say it is not my way and one which I could never accept.

However, I do thank-you for all of your insights and opening up the world of Shamanism to me. Continue to walk in peace and love.

CinnamonMoon:
***Note*** For some reason the edit function is messing up on me and I'm having to combine posts by this method. I apologize for the format, please keep reading.

Hi Earthwalker, I'm enjoying our conversations a lot.

I'm glad to hear you are comfortable knowing that the spirit world would understand your way of thinking and adapt to it. When I referenced "magic" it was not in the negative sense of the word, that comes from the individual's intent. What I mean by magic are the unexplained events that follow working with energy and Spirit Helpers (whatever form they may take). In that context the unknown (to the untrained) appears to be magical when understanding makes it simply reality. Conjuring tricks and illusions...that's stage magic and has nothing to do with what I was indicating at all. That's why you often find it spelled "magick" to differentiate the two.

"No spirit of integrity would ever approach me with magic in mind. It is not a path that I would walk and leads me to question the validness of the path for me."

I agree, and if you are dealing with such entities you are dealing with High Ceremonial Magic or Sorcery. It's not my path either.

Shamanic practice, as in all paths, has both the Dark and Light side to it. It's the individual walking that path that dictates the results of their journey and that through the choices they make. The Dark path eats us from the inside out and destroys. The Light path nurtures, and lets the love of Spirit shine through us to improve lives. It's choice. I would not say you have labeled anything incorrectly.

"My view of shamanism is strictly from a positive spiritualistic focus."

Mine too, and all who gather here as well.

"Given people's reluctance to be completely open and honest / unwillingness to post I am not sure of my comfort level.

" Are you talking about here at Spirit Lodge? If so I don't think you should take that personally. I tend to cover a lot of ground when I post and if others think I have covered something they would have said they may not post and repeat it. There are some who won't be able to address your comments, many here are just beginning their paths or have reached intermediate levels too so they may not understand what you are looking for in answering a post. I've been on my path for over 35 years and you can see that it took us awhile to understand one another and we're still working on that so please don't take any silence here personally. It just means people are away, feel the question was answered, or don't know what to say. You'll hear from all of us eventually *S*.

"However, I do thank-you for all of your insights and opening up the world of Shamanism to me. Continue to walk in peace and love.

" That's what Spirit Lodge is for, not simply the shamanistic views but all paths and we honor each and every one here. No path is "wrong", no path is "right", they are there for those that gravitate to that perspective. We need them all...at least for now. It's a pleasure getting to know you and I hope you'll find many of your answers here or at least a good finger pointing you in the right directions to locate them. I look forward to your posts and I'm sure others do too. We have many who visit and never post, but they learn from reading them and if that's what they need that's fine too. This is a place to gather thoughts, pose questions, share, and enjoy the company of like (and different) minds. Do keep posting, Earthwalker, there are many who may be benefitting by what you have to say behind the scenes, and certainly up front too.

Ghostkatt:
Hi Earthwalker...nice to meet you! Sorry I haven't been answering your posts…I've been under the weather this past week, so haven't done any posting. *smiles* I can't pretend to have any answers you're looking for...but I can share my opinions with you for what they're worth.

Premise one I agree with...
Premise two...are you stating that Spirit is just pure mindless energy, unable to interact independent of physical stimulation...personally I know that Spirit acts in my world independent of my stimulating it to do so...with no direction from the conscious or physical level to do so. I was gifted by a journey with my Guide...who took me through the tree of life and showed me for a brief moment what it is like to exist in a timeless place...past, present, future are all occurring...it blew my mind frankly. I'm not ready for that...I don't think any human is at this point in our evolution. We place the limits of time on ourselves because we just aren't equipped yet to handle more. Can I ask this, how do you see our Guides then? Are They Spirit hanging in limbo waiting for us to will them into our lives? *smiles*

I think the catalyst between realms is will and desire...both ours and Spirit. I do truly believe that Spirit is completely independent...It moves to it's own rhythms and patterns...it's the desire to help us on our journey that brings a merging or joining of man and Spirit.

How do you define living?

For me there is a connection to earth...rocks...crystals...plants...animals...trees...the air...etc., etc...they all have Spirit...it takes patience and a willingness to quiet yourself and just be in order to hear them...animals you get a quick response, humans even quicker...crystals...depends on the age and type of crystal and what it's vibrational levels are...fire...likes me far too much for my comfort level and responds very quickly! LOL! I'm not sure if this is what you're wondering about? I don't require my Guides to talk with them...there is no intermediary. I do find this easier though if I am at least in Alpha state, if not lower. That's part of the reason so many different cultures use a particular drum beat...it helps to induce Alpha state.

In regards to the black Jaguar...I don't know much about the Incan Medicine path...but I do know someone here that studies it, and I know that they work extensively with Black Jaguar medicine.

I think that if Jaguar had approached you with negative intents, you would have figured that out pretty quick! In my experience, Cats are not the type to just sit around and let you guess what They want! Sounds like he was sizing you up...the fact that he relaxed towards the end sounds like he thinks you are worthy! LOL!

As for Shamanism and it's various paths...like anything, there's good and bad to it...you have to look for the path that calls to you. Native Americans are not the only Shamans...there are Shamans in Peru, Mexico, the Rainforests, Australia, Brazil, Siberia...they share similar traits, and then there are some very big differences. I think you need to listen to what your heart is telling you about it...open to Spirit and follow the trail that opens before you. Study some of the different paths if they interest you...you're seeking, this is a good thing...and I know that there is something out there that will totally ring true for you...you will feel it in every fiber of being...you will "know" it like nothing you've ever known before...it will become a part of your life, your day to day activities...I hope that you do continue to ask questions here and that you do keep seeking. Thanks for the questions...I hope I was able to answer you, at least from my perspective anyhow!

Earthwalker:
Cinnamon, Thank you for commenting and I am sure I will post at least occasionally, I do like your openness. I apologize for getting so frustrated but you hit on one of my pet peeves.

To me most if not all religions / spiritual practices keep their following by conjuring up negative “fear “ factors. They are hidden behinds words like dark spirit, devils, fallen angels and are always shrouded under the cloak of mystery and magic, the unknown or the forbidden. Your comment just hit a nerve along with prior postings not to discuss closing of portals and comments insinuating that these negative things cannot be talked about on the web site only open or behind closed doors.

You may have perfectly good reasons and legitimate reasons for not addressing negativity on the web-site and it is your web-site. Quite frankly, I personally wouldn’t want that to become a main topic either. I was just disappointed in the chosen terms: mystery, magic in comments to me in regards to the black jaguar. I realize after reading your comment that in reality they were just semantic terms; yet, to me they conjure up all that I distrust and hate.

As a child, I wasn’t allow to have my palm read (evil spirits reside there). As an 18 year old I finally found a friend who was “psychic” and was involved in research; before class several us were having fun reading everyone palm; she wouldn’t read mine nor would comment why. In either case, the simple truths would have been far superior then what I imagined. It certainly didn’t leave scars since these were meant to be fun but the cloak of mystery remained; honesty would have been much more positive.

My personal feeling is that whenever facts are hidden and not thoroughly discussed, you give life to the fear and in fact create the monster out your thought processes and imagination. Negative entities are generated by our own mind, and the willingness of people to allow misconceptions to go unresolved, undisclosed, and not disputed or challenged. This may help ensure the survival of the religion, group, unit, country, but ends up hindering the individual and is a lie if not by conveyance by abstinence. In the past, survival of the group, tribe etc. was of foremost importance and therefore these types of conditionings may have been appropriate. Today I feel they are inappropriate. I believe in truth, love and honesty in all walks of life and don’t ascribe to the concept that “we know but the masses cannot understand”. It seems to me that governments operate under that premise. As an example (one currently being written about in contemporary literature), how many individuals in the USA know that the Federal Reserve is owned, not by the US government, but individual banks. The thought process is the “masses do not need or want to know”.

Most organized religions have similar perspectives “we know the truth, just believe, just follow or else you will be at the mercy of the dark spirit, devil or fallen angels. By cloaking things under these disguises without discussion, understanding, and clear admission of what is unknown and known, the individuals / the sheep are kept close because of the fear that is conveyed which has often become all-encompassing due the power of imagination. These fears are what causes the differences and hate between groups, religions and entities. If only we could teach the universal truths that are common to all religions and see and respect that which is similar. To me the only way to obtain this outcome is through respect and understanding and full disclosure of the unknowns that are common in all areas of life including religion of all denominations. The avenue to that is through open discussion and bringing forth all fear / negativity so that it can properly be dissipated.

I was disappointed and frustrated finding the same semantics once again. It is so hard to make positive change when most people focus upon is the differences and conjure up these as being evil. I acknowledge that it is not my responsibility to change others truths but by nature I am an activator and frustrated by the web we entangled ourselves in disguised under the cloak of mystery. I rather focus on love as often depicted by white light; openness and all encompassing. White consists of all colors. Black the opposite of white should not connote negativity. The opposite of white is black, the absence of all color. I often wonder which is pure spirit? I don’t know. But I think the two combined would equate to the total, since neither could exist without the other. Yet one (is all) the other is absence of; not positive (good) and negative (evil). These are manmade interpretations. In the field of electrochemistry a current is carried from positive to negative; neither pole is good or evil, both are needed for the current to exist.

Ghostkatt, I wasn’t concerned about anyone not commenting upon the more scientific issues/ ramblings. I carry on about these things often and am use to being ignored; that doesn’t bother me in the least. I do however appreciate your note. I hope you are feeling better.

CinnamonMoon:
This post is a mind-bender for me since I don’t come from a scientific background and don’t speak in those terms comfortably. With this in mind I’ll address the issues as best I can in layman’s terms.

Before I address your comments, I just want to say that the linkage between the realms exists because they are found within the context of the physical dimension as well as outside it. It’s all One and this is why we refer (shamanically) to the Web of Life which permeates all dimensions. It’s why we see the Medicine Wheel, a structure in the physical sense of the word but also in the spiritual sense, as a *vehicle* to take us between the realms.

I believe some of your confusion stems from the tangibility of the physical laws to the intangibility of the spiritual laws, and each dimension functions on its own set of those laws according to its nature. We utilize the portals as links to the different realms; be they natural, manmade, or within ourselves. This said, I’m going to humbly attempt to address your issues, and note that I think Silver Eagle, Lune, as well as Ghostkatt are all better qualified than I am to address the scientific perspectives.

This will be long as I’m going to be quoting you to respond properly and in the flow of your own comments.

You stated: Premises:
"1.)Simple expressed, in the physical realm, the responses generated by a stimulus of any kind (the cause) yields a corresponding effect (result) on an organism. This reaction occurs in the dimension of linear time."
Yes. This is the law of cause, effect, and retribution (result).

"2.)In the spiritual realms, a form(s) of pure energy (undefined) exists. It exists in a dimension of timelessness; therefore the laws of cause and effect do not apply."
Contrary to what you are perceiving here, and granted that the spiritual realm is not ruled by time, time does play a part there. Past, present, and future are One it's simply not linear as we know it. Cause, effect, and retribution *do* apply in each dimension. Each dimension is populated by entities just as the physical world is and there are events there just as here.

From a higher perspective the creative force of energy that feeds it all is that of Spirit and like the human body with it’s various energies comprised of a whole, the universe and dimensional worlds react much the same. "Since there is no time dimension there cannot be a reaction without a stimulus; only an equilibrium between existing states of energy can exist. In other words, the realm of spirit needs a stimulus from the physical realm to change its state of equilibrium." I would argue this based on the Will of Spirit and the activities of the Spirit Teachers, Guides, and Guardians that work with us. Their worlds are just as real as ours, perhaps less dense (tangible) but just as valid nevertheless. They function independently from us, much as involuntary muscles of the body do, but they are One with us as well and thus the laws of physics (IMHO) are present throughout, perhaps shifting perspectives some from time to time, but there are natural laws to all dimensions just as there are here. It’s not a vacuum. Think of the different layers of air surrounding earth. We've named them, we know they exist, but the average person isn't going to separate them like a scientist would. They are all part of Air, but not the same, like the dimensions vary in their own ways, but are part of the whole of All Dimensions...Spirit.

"3.)The spiritual realm can therefore only cause an effect in linear time by interacting in a mechanical way [probably as a catalysis] in-acting a change in the physical. Alternatively the physical realm can cause a change in the equilibrium of the spiritual realm which it cannot do without such a linkage due to the timelessness in the spiritual realm."
Shamanic teachings will all express the primary truth that all things are seeded in spirit before they manifest in the physical sense. That’s why we work so extensively in the spirit realms. Things seeded there are the birth of all Medicine Work/or spell-weaving, or whatever term you prefer to apply as a term. When we work "magick" we work spiritually. "

Thoughts/questions:

What is the mechanism /linkage of this interaction or catalysis between realms (energy to physical or physical to energy)?

" The Self (inner spirit) and our Will/Intent.

"If the mechanism is through an interaction of the energy imbedded in physical entities what level is it at? The elemental, the molecular, the cellular, the organism or the species?"

I would say all the above depending on the extent of work being done, and the training the individual has undergone. The elemental forces are often called into play along with their entities after a relationship is initiated and established. Thus the teaching of the Seven Sacred Directions one at a time will prepare the student to unify them and work within that context. The molecular and cellular comes into play where shapeshifting, projection of the inner spirit, journey work, passage through veils/portals, etc. are concerned. The organism comes into play as direct results manifest from a distance (as in healing or effecting change in the physical sense). The species…humanity itself…has a direct link to Spirit, the Creator, and in this way We Are All Related, all parts of the whole, all part of the Web of Life and we have our own strands that are interwoven.

Try to imagine this as encompassed in an enormous spiritual body. We are the cells that have jobs to do and we dwell upon one of the internal organs (planets). The universe is a macrocosm and a microcosm just as we are. There are worlds within worlds. Science can’t explain fully what black holes are. They are out in space, we have known them to exist without explanation for a long time. Does that make them any less *real*? No. They could be portals, which I suspect, in their own right…perhaps the veins of Spirit’s body? Who’s to say fully? Does it need to be scientifically validated or explained before it can be accepted? This has always been a pet peeve of mine. I can’t scientifically explain how the Wind reacts to my requests, but it does and I can accept that based on the results I get. I can't scientifically explain my Totems and Guides other than relying on what Jung has said and that's only his theory or his way of semantical explanation. It’s enough for me to experience this repeatedly and I don’t need to define it further getting hung up on that. I simply accept it as *my* reality and work with it. We each have our own reality as well, and that’s part of the physical illusion. You see we are the witness, in the physical sense, and our inner spirit is the one with a purpose to convey so we can fulfill it. When we see ourselves as such we learn a great deal more than when we fight that concept. IMHO

"This may be partly answered by where spirit interactions in the physical realm can occur. From a shamanic perspective, interactions occur, I believe, at all levels where life exits (species/organism/ cellular)."

Pretty much, yes.

"Can interaction occur with non-living matter (stones, earth, etc.) without a primary connection to another physical entity with spirit being the intermediary? If so then the action could be at either the elemental or molecular level. If not what level of consciousness does the living organism need to possess to be able to tap into the spiritual realm?"

Oh yes. Mountains, the land itself, and stones (The Stone People), trees and plants (The Standing People and Green Growing Things), Mother Earth and minerals…all are alive. They have their own energy, and inner spirits. They may process thought faster or slower than we do, in more complex or simpler terms than we do. That’s why there are teachings that the student can follow to learn to communicate with them…to enter the Silence of Spirit and learn those languages, perspectives, and wisdoms. Think of the work done with crystals, spiritually and physically they have energy that permeates all dimensions. Nothing in the physical realm is truly solid, it’s all molecular, and thus has the capability of passing through the dimensions with it’s presence—or the dimensions can penetrate physical "matter" by passing *through* the spaces between molecules....solid objects.

I have stepped into what I call Source Energy (that which comes from the universe and Spirit in the creative aspect, the Life Force, and I have ridden it through dimensional realms. I’ve watched it come (an energy signature) and pass through solid walls making them transparent. It’s awesome to see but, unless you experience it, quite difficult to grasp in concept. It’s just that here energy takes form and appears much denser. The physical realm is all about illusion and breaking through that with spiritual perspectives, then returning to it to serve others and effect positive changes for the Higher Good. Personal experience validates many things science cannot explain.

"If energy/spirit can shapeshift and enter other areas and physically change the location of items etc. what connection needs to be on the other end?"

Intent/Will and the knowledge of how to do this.

"For this to occur there must be some type of physical interaction between the spirit energy and the object or object energy."

There are dimensions that mirror ours, and when we enter those we can move something that way with our spirit body and thus move it in the physical sense where it is mirrored. It’s very often one of the first exercises given students learning to astral project. Often things are brought back to the physical world on accident or intentionally as well. Some people feel that there are times things fall from the air termed "apports" as gifts from the spirit world.

"If this is true, this just answered in part my above question since if you can move a non-living object purely from the spiritual dimension then the mechanism of action must be at the molecular or elemental level. However, this would be true only if another connection is not being made to a living species in another location of the physical realm connected through the spiritual realm."

"Time is relevant here, in the spirit realms we can move backward, along the present, or into the future. That’s not something that would prevent such an act from happening but would allow it to happen regardless of what is currently taking place. Again, this takes training to understand and experience to master. It’s advanced work and you are coming to this from a beginning standpoint. It’s like teaching someone to multiply and divide and them asking the teacher how a matrix works. They don’t have the training to understand that yet so it will all be foreign to their mind until they do. You can present part of the theory but it’s only information at that point. It takes experience to know something and that knowledge comes down the line yet. So you are a bit ahead of yourself in the way you are approaching these issues, but I understand it is your perspective to take the scientific approach which reqires all the analysis you are undergoing. I'm not critical of that. It's your way and for you it's right. But you are ahead of yourself in study needing more basics from what I can see here. I don't mean that offensively, but there are huge gaps in your perceptions that need filling in from what I perceive.

"What I am looking for is what is the physical /energy or mechanism of change occurring in the physical realm to link to the spirit world and physical world or worlds in other dimensions. If this one link could be defined or made known it would clarify so much and answers the question of portals, shapeshifting, journeying etc.

" I hope I have somewhat accomplished that already here. It truly is all One and just different aspects of the whole. As I said earlier, this "spirit body" of dimensional realms functions as aspects to the whole, and thus are One body.

"I know that there are theories out there which suggest that long term memory actual resides in a universal field of energy but still the theories do not define the linkage from the physical entity to this universal memory bank or dimension other than to define a god spot in the right temporal lobe."

Energy carries information. It stores it, just as DNA and cells of the body do.

"If anyone has thoughts or ideas please let me know. I know and believe in Shamanism but I also know that there also has to be change at the physical level to gain access to other realms of spirit etc. I would love to understand as well as believe."

The various states of the mind (brain waves can be traced) take us into many different levels of trance from light to extremely deep. Once these "states of mind" are achieved we are capable of doing different things on spiritual levels and our inner spirit takes over where the physical body cannot. It has the capability to traverse the dimensional realms because it is pure energy. We need to realize that we are spirits with bodies, not bodies with spirits. That simple altered perspective puts a whole new twist on things and brings understanding. When we surrender control to our inner spirit it is free to guide us through life and our pathwork. It’s our direct link to everything. When it leaves the body it does not die, it continues on in its own life. This world is a temporary stop for lessons, a classroom if you will, and it’s up to us to be willing to accept that as our truth. If we do we embrace it and move relatively quickly along our way. If we struggle with it we can stagnate, and if we ignore it totally or refuse to accept it we waste this life in many ways. In that sense we are our own Witness to our own Life and our own Reality working with others (Guides, Totems, Spirit Helpers, Guardians, Protectors, Teachers, etc. as well as spirit groups.) who are there to help us understand. This in mind, and knowing you have contact with such entities in your own experience, I would like to challenge you to address these questions to them and see what they tell you. You may be surprised at how simple that understanding is because they know *you* how you think, process information, and assimilate things and can put it in terms *you* will understand with greater enlightenment and less effort than any human can.

I hope this helps in some small way.

earthwalker:
GHostkatt, Your comments may have a lot of meaning I just need to think about them. It’s been a long day. I would very much like to see and feel that world you were taken to even if we aren't ready. Maybe someday that will be the path, I am just unsure for now. The concept of negative spirit etc. just don't make since to me since if spirit guides are there to show you the way they would never be negative in approach. Thanks for writing.

Cinnamon:
Hello Earthwalker, I was *not* trying to use a fear factor as they are my pet peeve in teachings too and I think they are unnecessary. I'm sorry if I came off that way. However, I do know firsthand that there are *dark* spirits or *negative* entities. I've come face to face with them and it tested every ounce of inner strength and courage I had on more than one occasion. It's not simply a fear tactic to not discuss them. However, I'm not going to encourage that exploration by inept seekers who haven't a clue as to the dangers they are getting into and there are dangers out there. That's just a fact. To think otherwise is no better than thinking ignorance is bliss and I can't condone that either. They are real. We don't know who is reading the posts here, but we do know that our age span of members is from grade school on up. How much of this is appropriate and how much is for the field day? Well, personally I'm not having a field day with this subject knowing they may be reading things out of context with nothing concrete to base their opinions on and sorely misled in that process. Maybe that's a false fear of mine, but I think it's a very real issue and I'd rather error on the side of caution there. I'm a mother and a grandmother myself and that's important to me, so are many others here, and their families come here to learn.

If someone wants to label an entity as "dark spirit", "devil", "fallen angel" or anything else along those lines it's merely a matter of semantics, but there are beings beyond the physical world that are not nice and they do cross the lines of dimension from time to time. Why do you think the Church has rites for exorcism? This is one of the reasons for *Shielding* ourselves, for maintaining the highest thoughts we can as they are attracted and feed off the energy of those with lower, more selfish, more greedy thoughts. If someone is seeking their path for the purpose of power over others they are going to meet these entities face to face sooner or later. So by keeping your intentions for the higher good the odds are that you will not run into them. Teach only the higher good and you teach with tunnel vision. Even in that you'll find situations where confrontations occur with such entities. Teaching both is important, but in the right context of that teaching (IMHO).

Spirituality is not all black and white, it has grey areas too and we all tend to weave back and forth from time to time just being humans and having faults. There is a cloak of mystery around the *Dark Path* of any religion or spiritual tradition, most people don't want to deal with those things, and those that do deal with them keep those methods to themselves for a reason...it's dangerous work. Magic*K* is the unknown, once you understand it the mystery is gone. Magick is working with energy, but once you understand the process, the patterns, the sources, the mystery is gone. To the uninitiated it's all phenomenal...unexplained...unknown...scary...weird...strange...occult.

When I said that I would not publicly discuss closing portals insinuating that these negative things cannot be talked about on the web site only on em or behind closed doors you bet I had good reasons. There are people of all ages and levels here, some post, some just come and read. We have hundreds of visitors a day. I'm responsible for what I put on my posts and I'll be darned if I'm going to give information about such matters (matters that take highly advanced knowledge to contend with in the first place) into the hands of children or even young adults who haven't a clue as to what they are really looking at along those lines. It's careless and irresponsible. I do discuss these matters openly with my students and in private, but not here. I think it's highly inappropriate.

I will openly discuss negativity, the concepts of negative entities (in fact we have articles on that subject matter in our Knowledge Center), but to discuss techniques for confronting them or how to find them or how to banish them or how to close their portals or anything along those lines is feeding trouble into inexperienced hands. This site is designed to help people find their way to the path that's right for them. It's designed to help people find their way to Spirit, not encourage reckless explorations that could lead to trouble and possibly some serious psychological damage. As I said there are elementary school children that come here and read the posts as well as adults and we need to be responsible with the information we share. So it's my preference to have people that are addressing *dark* issues do so in private. I hope that makes sense to you. I want the site to remain positive and productive, not one that has witch-wars or attracting the attention of those who choose to walk a Dark Path in any tradition. It's just not so simple as everything being black and white and to think along those lines is deceiving yourself.

The terms: mystery, magic, etc. are only semantics here. With this many paths brought together there are going to be many terms used to describe the same issues and as you get used to talking in a group like this you'll start to differentiate them. If you look for the Black Jaguar in any books that interpret the animals you will find that those terms are quite commonly associated with it. Not in a negative sense, but certainly the teachings of Jaguar could be used in negative ways. That's the individual's choice, it's their intentions that differentiate the path they walk and the deeds they do just as it is our intentions in anything we do or say.

I realize that many parents, as yours did, forbid their children to partake of the *occult* or any sort of non-traditional path. It's not quite as bad today as it was when I was growing up, but it still exists, especially in the Bible-belt areas here in America. Metaphysical studies are deeply frowned upon and I have several friends that have to struggle against those antiquated notions daily. It doesn't mean that they are right, but they believe they are and intend to enforce those beliefs on themselves and others. We force nothing here.

As for your psychic friend that refused to read you, she may have seen something that frightened her or that she didn't understand, but I agree, it would have been better to tell you something about that. It's hard. I read for people professionally and no one likes to pass on bad news. When I see trouble coming at people I warn them about it but in a way that's constructive. "You need to think about changing your way of doing this or that, if you don't it looks like trouble could be waitng and it's up to you do avoid that now." Or "Have you been feeling poorly? Perhaps you should see a doctor and have a physical, it seems that there could be something brewing now that if caught in time will help you avoid being ill later." That type of thing rather than predicting certainty of a bad situation. I don't hold with doom and gloom. Inexperienced readers will see things and feel they are carved in stone, or mean the worst when they are simply issues that, if acted upon now, can be avoided. Your friend was more than likely inexperienced in this.

"My personal feeling is that whenever facts are hidden and not thoroughly discussed, you give life to the fear and in fact create the monster out your thought processes and imagination."

Perhaps in some cases that's true, but understanding why we don't discuss this type of thing out of context of teaching some lesson, it does (hopefully) shed better light on things and validate why we choose to be cautious.

"Negative entities are generated by our own mind, and the willingness of people to allow misconceptions to go unresolved, undisclosed, and not disputed or challenged. This may help ensure the survival of the religion, group, unit, country, but ends up hindering the individual and is a lie if not by conveyance by abstinence."

Here I have to disagree with you. I know there are entities/spirits and not all of them are good ones. I know and work with Spirit Guides constantly, I have all my life, and thinking that these entities exist only in our minds is foolish. IMHO. Yes, in the past, survival of the group, tribe etc. was of foremost importance and these types of conditionings did serve a purpose as every venture out of the camp was a risk. Even today, in places like South America, shamanic teachings are given based on fear...fear of evil, of negative entities, of abusing magick, of those who would steal yours, of death hanging over your left shoulder ready to claim you at any moment. Some people work from that premise. I don't take that approach, that's my choice, but many do and they find value in it. It doesn't sit well with me either but it is their way and I have to give tolerance for it. I don't have to take that path, however, and that is my choice.

"I believe in truth, love and honesty in all walks of life and don’t ascribe to the concept that “we know but the masses cannot understand”....I wasn't trying to imply that at all and if someone wants this kind of information I'll email with them or suggest a source to explore it. Michael Harner deals with this quite a bit in his teaching. Castaneda dealt with it, I'm not sure if you are familiar with Crowley, but he walked a path of Light and switched to a Dark one along the way. It destroyed him dealing with the spirits he conjured and the greed he fed on to gain more power.

I understand that many religions teach the masses one thing and the clergy another. I also understand why. The clergy has been trained to understand those teachings, the masses have not. Most of those in the masses couldn't comprehend the heightened awareness necessary to achieve that understanding. It comes from training and from experience. In shamanic circles, children with gifts are recognized young, trained, and prepared for their role in life. In the Church it is the priest that is Called to his role, schooled in areas that the public has no access to. If someone wants those teachings they need to attend seminary or theological schools to study. It's just not out there on the open market, the demand is not that great. But when it all comes down to the bottom line the differences in traditions are only methods and often semantical. The truths remain on all paths. If someone truly wants to know these things and holds love in their heart, well, Spirit will see they receive the lessons they ask for...the secret is to ask.

It's for this reason that I often say Religion is of man, Spirituality is within and of Spirit. There is a difference. We do discuss universal truths here and we do promote tolerance for all paths. So the table is open for discussion on just about anything you can imagine. The issue of Dark Paths and entities is one that needs to be set up properly though not just jumped into at random (again IMHO) because of those who are part of our community openly or behind the scenes being so young, so inexperienced (at any age). We can so easily mislead by a statement that does not precede itself with fundamental basics they should have to base their judgment on.

I agree, sharing and full disclosure of the unknowns do need to be brought out into the open, but you wouldn't put a child in a laboratory full of chemicals if they didn't understand the dangers of mixing them and leave that child unattended. It's irresponsible. The same thing applies here. You have to have the background before you can step into this type of thing. So if you feel disappointed that you are encountering those old semantics here, I'm sorry to hear that. Perhaps opening up a discussion at ground level would be better. That way it could follow a natural (and informed) discourse. May I suggest you read the article on Entities in the Knowledge Center and then address any questions you may have here after that? I think it's the perspective applied to the onset of the discussion that's important to how far or how deep it's taken rather than jumping into the middle of something blindly. And pardon me for saying this, but IMHO you are misleading yourself if you think these entities are a figment of someone's imagination or mind. It's much more than that.

To focus on love as often depicted by white light; openness and all encompassing, is fine, but it requires understanding of it's opposite to maintain balance. Shamanism, or any other spiritual or religious pathway is not all White Light. That's blinding yourself to believe that. There is a taint to all, temptation is there, abuse is there, and to deny that is foolish. It exists and there are people who promote it, inside and outside those circles, and that's a fact.

It's not that White consists of all colors, and Black the absence of color, it's that White represents purity and Black represents the darkness. In the case of the Jaguar, a Black one is going to represent (universally speaking) feminine mysteries, magick, the unknown, but also the teachings of the species. To fully grasp all that you need to study Jaguar Medicine. It's not negative. The only negative thing about it is intention behind it that the person using it asserts. A fire can burn you if you put your hand in it, but if you stand back that same fire can provide heat, or if you put a pan on it you can cook. Is it bad? No. It's the intention of the person behind the act that brings about the results they get. Black and White are both of Spirit...both aspects of the whole, but so are all the other colors we have. It's all a part of the whole, the positive, the negative, the dark, the light...all part of the whole. How it's applied determines if it is good or bad...and that's a grey area too. *Smiles*

earthwalker:
Cinnamon, Thank you for sharing your experience and perspective. It does help. I just need to go back and explore more so I can get a better understanding. Obviously you have experience in these areas; I do not. Therefore I will need to take you word in regards to the opposites. Have a good evening.

Lune, Ghostkatt, and Cinnamon, Thank you all! I'll try to reply to all of your comments so this may be somewhat disjointed.

First of all I need to let others know that could be reading this website how truly gracious Cinnamon is. My comments were somewhat of a challenge not consciously but something I automatically do to see what individuals real intentions are. As an example I almost always tell Physicians that I want a second opinion and a discussion of all possibilities. Usually it is easier to just put the phone aside until they stop justifying their own opinion and yelling at me. For me the really good physicians will always welcome the discussion of options and indicate why they are recommending a path. They won't try to get you into a study that they are involved with and if they are suggesting it will readily acknowledge their potential conflict of interests. Cinnamon was unusually gracious in honestly presenting her beliefs while not trying to force them on anyone else. She was equally gracious about discussing some of the problems that have or can occurred when conflicts of interest could occur. I believe Cinnamon is open, honest and deeply cares about the individuals on this website. However, Cinnamon, I would have liked to been a fly on the wall when you read the message (s)?

Cinnamon, as a suggestion, it might be helpful individuals if you could present some guidance in how to discern a good teacher from one that has alternative intents? I haven't noticed anything on the website but I may have overlooked it.

Ghostkatt , Thank-you for making me look at Inca Black Jaguar medicine. I haven't found a lot about the subject and some of it is contradictory but it is very interesting. If you know of any particular good books on the subject I'd appreciate the information.

All, Cinnamon's discussion as well as the black jaguar opened up some understanding for me although I am still working through a lot. I believe the Jaguar was a balance to the white power. Both were gifts although I don't know why I would be given this gift. My parents came with the snow leopard (father) and swan (mother). [I was at peace knowing my father was as he should be in the more wild worlds and my mother with the swan. She always loved the beauty of the bird and loved that which was graceful and elegant. She didn't have a lot of it while she was alive either when in her own home or mine. I was therefore happy to see her in a realm that she would have enjoyed. I guess we all wish we could have given back more than we could in our lives.] I suspect they came with the sacred animals as a way of indicating to me that they acknowledged that my path was correct or a least a possibility for me. This was something they never could do while they were alive; we always just agreed to disagree. At 14 on a playground I decided that "if god was love and love was god, god had to be energy". To me the total sum of the black jaguar and all the white animals represented the source energy (balanced between the parts). The black jaguar (absence of light) powers seemed to equal the total sum of the whites animals energy. They seemed to represent the sum of all colors within each kingdom. I felt that the black jaguar was the protector of the sacred white animals. Yet I feel that the cat gains its respect fromthe fear factor with in our selves (possibly an illusion). He has come to me many times since, he always looks mean and stares through his green eyes. He places his outstretched paw with claws showing into the air and paws at me. I usually just intuitively tell him that I hope that is his way of saying hello and if not he can leave; he stays and hangs around, he is comforting and quite beautiful in his own right. In regards to the white animals I am not sure of what they were telling me but somehow they seemed to be communicating universal truths. I need to study them more. The white buffalo was the one most difficult for me to read, it lingered a little more in the background while the polar bear, the owl, swan, the snow leopard, and the Christian spirit walker were in the for front. Possibly they were all part of the white buffalo since as they diminished in intensity she became more clearly viewed. I just need to read more. I also don't think I was really looking for meanings, I truly was just trying to give back what I could to the beautiful land and world we live in; albeit not much by comparison.

One of Cinnamon's comment about intent opened up a lot of thought processes for me. Between her discussion on negative entities, recognizing possibly my own fear of the "occult" and seeing and dealing with the black jaguar I moved well past the fear of the unknown in the spirit world. I acknowledged that you cannot live in fear of the unknown in the spirit world any more than you can live in fear of the unknown in the physical world. We walk everyday amongst bacteria and pathogens in the air, on the earth, in the water and in and as combustion products of fire. There are negative things that can kill us in each; yet we don't dwell on it, we don't walk in fear. Our intent is to live positively. Death is a normal part of the circle of life you cannot truly live if you are afraid to die. So too does this apply to the spiritual world. The black jaguar does evoke fear until you get to know him but it is just his/her way. Most sources say it is female, a couple of sources say male. From dealing with him/her and accepting him/her I feel that I can walk in the spirit world and feel no more fear that I have in the physical realm. I believe Cinnamon is right about intent. The intent of our being protects us in the realms as it does in the physical realm. We will be effected but only to the degree of our intent and genetic makeup in the physical and to the degree of our intent and spiritual make up in the spirit world. It took an awful lot for me to see something so simple. I apologize for my blindness.

Ghostkatt discussed the right path just feeling right and I guess I am still on the path of a seeker. I know that there is a sacredness to our home and I know that we are physical entities within energy and the total energy is labeled by religions and spiritual paths differently. Yet there are universal truths to all of the paths. I seem to focus on this a lot. Yet, I also feel I am being pulled along some type of path, the where's or why's of which I do not know. It seems to be coming from the world of shamanism but certainly not to the level you have all been drawn to it. I guess, time will tell and possibly the black jaguar will lead me whatever I am to deal with next. Maybe some of you know but I certainly don't. For now my horizons are expanding and I am learning that barriers need to be broken down.

Doc:
Hehe, Reminds me of when I start a book, and suddenly stop reading it for weeks or months. Suddenly I want to read it again, and there is a topic that life has just presented me, a few paragraphs from where I left off....

Cinnamon:
"Cinnamon, as a suggestion, it might be helpful individuals if you could present some guidance in how to discern a good teacher from one that has alternative intents? I haven't noticed anything on the website but I may have overlooked it."

I think you did and there are some posts to that in this forum. One I know is titled "Fiinding a Teacher", the other is "Teacher Student Relationships" and both are currently active at the moment so you shouldn't have trouble locating them here. We can address any questions you may have after reading either of the threads.

You needn't apologize for your blindness, it's when we stub our toes we learn that we preoccupy ourselves with complications to hold us in place until we figure things out. *S* We're all blind in our own ways and that's what the journey is about...seeing into the darkness and shedding light on what really does matter.

Lune:
ok my shot at it I think I will answer you before I read all the other posts as I think I will get muddled up... I am having trouble understanding what you are asking.
But I think that is just that, like you said it is semantics. And I am even (*she says, thinking of all the times she has explained a shamanic concept to her scientifically minded family*) having trouble following your "tech" (*grins*) to understand the question.

But you know, that has just made me realize I am used to working the other way. I learnt shamanism through shamanic terminology and language and experience, and now spend an awful lot of time figuring out how to explain what is going on in scientific way - As opposed to what you are doing which is asking a shamanic question with scientific terminology *giggles* If I have got it right.

ok so it seems to me you are saying you recognize the linkage between the worlds but are trying to understand the mechanism of that linkage? what is is made from and what are it's laws?

That is simple... everything is energy. The physical world is energy and so is the spiritual. This is both a scientific concept and a shamanic concept. They are all the same framework of energy, all the same world, just different layers. Therefore the "linking mechanism" is then same as the linking mechanism between co2 and global climate change. It is all interrelated energy. As it is all one. When in doubt come back to this premise and look at things from the perspective of energy. So when there is a shift in energy in one part, it affects the whole in complex but often beautiful ways.

So a stone is quite heavy and quantifiable from a human perspective of picking it up and feeling it. By the same token the concentration of a particular gas in the air around you IS quantifiable, but you need more tools than just your hands to know what gasses and what ratios. (unless of course it is really obvious like hydrogen sulfide) But changes in those ratios effect the whole of the planet anyway. The spirit world is just the same, but we haven't figured out any groovy technology to quantify that - yet. (though I think the finer points of say quantum mechanics or complexity theory or ecology are on the right track) But it works in the same way. You change something in the physical world, it has repercussions throughout all the world, all it's layers. It is just that for the spiritual world, the tool that is used to feel and understand it is the human mind, and body and heart and soul. That is the tool "one eye in the world of the physical, one in the world of spirit. One ear in the world of the physical, one ear in the world of spirit".

However I think trying to understand shamanism through scientific principals and thought processes is like trying to understand something from a description of its parts. Really, shamanism is more than a description of the sum of its parts, it is the EXPERIENCE of the whole, and from there and experience of its parts, then back again to an experience of the whole. Experience.

Actually, I have changed my mind. I will let that stand as an explanation, but really, my answer to the questions you ask is.... what do YOU feel is the link? What do YOU feel is the connecting thread between the physical and spirit? What do YOU feel is the message these beautiful spirit animals bring to you? What do you feel is their connection with the Black Jaguar? What does your heart feel, where your mind can only describe?

That is shamanism

Earthwalker:
Lune, I am not sure of the link. If certain brain waves are required an effect on brain amine levels could be exhibited. The fact that certain cultures in the past have used artificial means to induce dreaming suggests that there is a biochemical link to the brain amines, as well. However I am quite sure that it is a cascade effect and more complicated. In addition, please note I am not suggesting the use of artificial means to induce any dream state. The world itself offers so much beauty I cannot personally understand why anyone would want to diminish it.

I also wonder if there is a genetic link. A few weeks ago I was training an individual to eventually take over my position as supervisor and we were discussing addressing techniques to help solve a problem that effected the entire group. I indicated that the way I try to get a feel for the problem was to abstract myself and become an unbiased distant observer; thereby, viewing each individuals actions and responses including my own as unique. From this stand point, the team can thereby be guided into making the best decision for the group (obviously within the context of the goal and individual preferences). I was actually surprise when the individual indicated that there was no way to abstract the self like that. I wrongly assumed that this was normal across the human species. It gave me an insight to a question I have often asked in "how people can be so blind to others". Can't they see that we need diversity and respect that each individual has a different skill but complementary to one own. The strength of the team lies in the diversity and respect for each member skills. Yet, the fundamental step in seeing that is to observe oneself not as the center of the team or group but uniquely as one member with a particular set of skills. Are there any techniques which can bring out this fundamental skill in individuals. It seems to me that it is a minimum skill for accepting shamanism or any spiritual path different from one’s own let alone choosing and practicing something different. I guess what I am asking is this a learned behavior or one genetically programed? Can the environment make a difference?

In an attempt to understand, I am currently reading two books:
"Where God lives; the Science of the Paranormal and How Our Brains are Linked to the Universe." Melvin Morse MD and Paul Peery
"Miracles of the Mind; Exploring Nonlocal Consciousness and Spiritual Healing" Russell Targ and Jane Katra PhD

Doc, I have a feeling these will become part of my pile of books read to various stages. I do go back to re-read. The one book I initially read at 12 "The Prophet" is a book I have read multiple times over the decades. It is always amazes me how much I didn't see during earlier readings.

Silver Eagle, I am drawn to many paths; initially Catholicism (caremelite nuns), followed by energy theory, Tibeten masters of various sects, Buddhism, Taoism, Native American spiritual paths and now shamanism. To me the common thread has been that each respects the of journey of the individual and all have universal truths of love. They all have a mystical component as well.

Northernwolf:
I'm late to the discussion but here goes I thought I'd take a crack at this one.

You wrote : "What is the mechanism /linkage of this interaction or catalysis between realms (energy to physical or physical to energy)?"

Well to understand this or rather to have a different view of this I'd say that the first step is not to consider these two realm as being independent of each other. If you view it as both being present at the same time then the connection isn't all that difficult. This doesn't mean that the realms aren't separated though.

I'm not too good with physics but I'll try my hand at it using some notion of experiments that have been done.

Now, it's known ( although I don’t know how widely ) that it you place an observer in front of a random number machine for example, the result vary a bit, as if the observer itself causes a change in the pattern. I think those kinds of experiment have been done over and over and if I'm not mistaken, quantum physics is starting to accept the fact that observing something or putting one's attention one something will affect the way the molecules behave. Now with that in mind, I propose that this is the same phenomena that occurs when energy is brought on the material plain, what can be called magic. A bit like what Cinnamon said regarding the will. By focusing one's will with an intent towards a particular goal, would it be foolish to believe that the matter which in turn is comprise of energy itself could change to meet those goals? Personally I think it's not that foolish. If changes can be witness in a controlled environment by the mere fact of observing, focusing one’s mind or will on something should present more noticeable results.

AS for the link between matter and energy, Cinnamon mentioned the inner self. It is indeed through ourself that we tap those other realms and dimensions which are probable overlapping what we call our own reality. Personally the way it is done is I believe through a change in the energy vibrations of our own body. By changing those vibration we can tap or glimpse those other dimensions since we attune ourself to the vibration of those realms or dimensions. This is a process that is done in shamanic journeying, but even more so in trance states ( which shamanic journeying is a light form of ) and in vision quests, just to name a few.

So by being able to contact those other realms we can affect them and also we offer up a channel for them to manifest in our own reality. As we attune to it, it would be logical that it attunes to us in a way as well, thus we act as a portal for those energy and our will is the gate keeper, deciding what energy passes our not.

Earthwalker:
Nothernwolf, Thanks! It does make sense. Will and intent are definitely links. Wouldn't it be nice if we could will matter (like the dirt in my house) to just dissipate into energy(s).


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